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Thread: Καραγκούνηδες και Καραγκούνες

  1. #11
    Senior Member Theseus's Avatar
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    Thanks, 'Man. Where is the best place to find the traditional words to the Karagouna. There seem to be several versions. Clearly this lyric is crude:-
    Άντε θα σηκω...σηκώσω το φουστάνι
    άντε να μου το κα.... να μου το κάνεις μάνι μάνι
    αμ'πως'δα' αμ'πις'δα στα παράθυρα σε είδα
    αμ'πως'δα αμ'πις'δα την προκοπή σου είδα

    But what does προκοπή mean in this context? At least the traditional video you posted (whatever the words are), is a treat to listen to. Thank you.

  2. #12
    Senior Member SBE's Avatar
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    Τhere are several versions of the lyrics, as expected with demotic songs, but the gist is that the Karagouna in question is too pretty not to wear nice clothes, so the singer/ man, who saw her at her window and also saw that she was προκομένη (hard working, therefore good wife material) is willing to sell all his flock and land to buy her fine clothes and jewellery.
    Προκοπή = industriouness, leading to success

  3. #13
    Senior Member SBE's Avatar
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    The version I learned at school, which we were made to sing while learning the steps:
    Άιντε Καραγκούνα, Καραγκούνα, άιντε σε σι πρέπουν τα σιγκούνια
    Standard modern Greek: Καραγκούνα, εσένα σου πρέπουν τα σεγκούνια = σου αξίζει να φοράς σεγκούνια
    English: Karagouna, you deserve to wear a decorative overcoat
    According to Greek Wikipedia, only married Karagounes wore the full outfit, which included the said sleeveless ovecoat, young women wore plain dress, so perhaps the meaning of the verse is that she deserves to get married.
    Here is an image of a decorative sleeveless overcoat (σεγκούνι), although it can also be with sleeves and comes in various colours- however the Karagounes usually wore black

    Click image for larger version. 

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    Αμ πώς δα, αμ τί δα, στο παραθύρι σ'είδα
    Αμ πώς δα, αμ τί δα, την προκοπή σ' την είδα
    Αμ πώς δα, αμ τί δα both mean roughly "what did you think?" as in did you think he would make up his mind (that she is a suitable wife) without doing his research first? στο παραθύρι σ'είδα/ την προκοπή σ' την είδα I saw you at the window/ I noticed your industriousness.

    θα πουλήσω και τα γίδια
    να σου πάρω δαχτυλίδια= I will sell the goats and buy you rings

    θα πουλήσω και τη στάνη
    να σου πάρω ένα φουστάνι= I will sell the sheepfold to buy you a dress

    In other versions the Karagouna does not deserve a segouni (δεν σι πρέπουν τα σεγκούνια)- implying she deserves to wear western style clothes, and her suitor instead of noticing how hard working she is, tricks her into giving in σι γέλασα, σε πήρα.
    Notice the pronunciation of central Greece where ε is ι, as in σι= σε, not to be confused with συ= εσύ

    Perhaps the title of the thread should change to Καραγκούνηδες (of all kinds).

  4. #14
    Senior Member Theseus's Avatar
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    Thanks, 'Man & SBE, particularly here for her long excursus on the Karagouna. I agree with your suggestion to change the thread title to Καραγκούνηδες. In one version of the Karagouna the words σε γέλασα, σε πήρα occur:-
    Άιντε θα πουλή-, πουλήσω τα κατσίκια
    Άιντα να σου πά-, σου πάρω σκουλαρίκια
    Αμ’ πώς δα, αμ’ τι δα, σε γέλασα, σε πήρα..
    Do these words mean 'I laughed at you, I took you [as my wife]?

  5. #15
    HandyMod drsiebenmal's Avatar
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    σε γέλασα = I tricked you (as SBE already noted)
    Wer die Wahrheit nicht weiß, der ist bloß ein Dummkopf. Aber wer sie weiß, und sie eine Lüge nennt, der ist ein Verbrecher!
    We base decisions on facts, not superstition, not what our ideology tells us but rather what we can observe

    δεῖ δὲ χρημάτων, καὶ ἄνευ τούτων οὐδὲν ἔστι γενέσθαι τῶν δεόντων
    Η Ελλάδα είναι Ευρώπη, η Ευρώπη είναι Ελλάδα!

  6. #16
    Senior Member Theseus's Avatar
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    Mea culpa, SBE! Thanks, Dr.

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